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that can be in these programming tables. And you can figure out which one it is by going into. Like the window machine, go into the device manager and look at what's coming in through USB. And it'll tell you. So the one that you want to vist for Graham specifically, if it says PL 2303, that's the prolific chipset. That's the one that's the most problematic. You can get them to work with the right drivers. But it's better if you've got them. The best one is the FTDI, the Frank Tango Delta India. And there's another one called the CH340. And I've had good luck with those on both PCs.