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So, so there you go. But he's talked to tons of people I know. So that's how that works. And he was one of those guys. He was smart enough that he could have gotten the license for him radio. He just didn't care. He kicked ass on CW, but he just didn't really care enough to really, really take it seriously. Where I was taping CW so I can dissect it. He knew it right away. One of the things I used to do was when they would do the bulletin drills, the W1AW drills, and you could go online and get them or listen on the radio, I used to tape those and then I eventually just memorize them. So I wasn't even copying them anymore. I just remember I said because the bulletins were so easy and repetitive that I just started to remember I said, it's not good that they use those for code practice because people would just memorize them.