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And what their research goes on to suggest is that what also happens in these spaces, so mauled offices, once you remove office furniture, the space, it doesn't actually change. The space is the space. It doesn't get bigger. But our perception of the space increases, right? As you take stuff out of a space, it gets larger. You take everything out of the room in your house. You go, look how much space I have. The room never got any bigger. They just let it junk in there. Same thing occurs to these other occupied spaces. You take everything out. The space becomes bigger. You feel smaller. And you have also, what you expect is not what's there. You expect furniture. There's no furniture there. So it results in an atmosphere that's not overly hostile, but it is subtly threatening to you, right? And it sort of underlines, it mirrors the underlying tone that you would get with certain