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They went to the skip many many moons ago. It was working at the time and it was only a couple of pennies to buy it but it was really really heavy. It was pretty good technology for the time. I don't know if you can remember them. You probably can there Doug. Regarding H.F., yes, I totally agree the day before yesterday though. I did actually have flip up to 6 meters on 50 megs and I was open all around Europe there. That was interesting and also there was a couple of East Coast US stations on as well. It went up up up up up up up up up up to 8 on there and it was just full. It was like an F-T8 contest was on but there wasn't one. Back to you there Doug. V-E-3-X-D-B-W-A-S-Z-L.